运河访谈｜国乐大师方锦龙：用九千年古乐器与世界平视对话|古乐器|国乐大师|小提琴协奏曲|方锦龙|民族乐器|演奏|琵琶|运河访谈

九千年贾湖骨龠的悠远古音与二次元的鲜活律动同台竞技，东方民乐的无尽神韵对话世界多元音乐语言，一把五弦琵琶实现环球“音乐漫游”……9月25日，中秋佳节之夜，《斗·乐×二次元》方锦龙×新九州爱乐国风视听音乐会空降扬州运河大剧院。古今曲目碰撞、中外乐器和鸣、“方式脱口秀”穿插，与他现场命名的“诗乐之都——扬州”来了一场同频共振。The ancient sounds of the Jiahu bone zither, which date back 9,000 years, compete with the vibrant rhythms of the anime world. The infinite charm of Eastern folk music interacts with various musical languages around the world. A five-string pipa enables a global “musical journey”… On September 25th, on the night of the Mid-Autumn Festival, the “Battle of Music × Anime” concert featuring Fang Jinlong and New Kyushu Philharmonic’s traditional Chinese music performance took place at Yangzhou Canal Grand Theatre. The combinations of ancient and modern pieces, as well as the use of instruments from different cultures, along with “comedy performances”, created a harmonious atmosphere that resonated with the concept of “Yangzhou – the City of Poetry and Music” as described by him during the concert.

他与世界运河之都扬州的缘，起于18岁那年，在芬兰赫尔辛基世界音乐节马拉松音乐会上演奏的《春江花月夜》。这首描绘扬州江月的“孤篇盖全唐”的千古名诗，其音乐篇章从他的琵琶下壮阔激越般流出，欧洲的观众当场惊叹“一把琵琶就是一个交响乐团”。这次成功让方锦龙意识到，中国的民族音乐可以登上国际大舞台。His connection with Yangzhou, the “City of Canals” in the world, began when he was 18 years old. It was during a marathon music event at the World Music Festival in Helsinki, Finland, that he performed the piece “Spring River and Flower Moon Night”. This famous poem, which depicts the scenery along the rivers in Yangzhou, can be considered a masterpiece that encompasses all other poems from the Tang Dynasty. The musical elements of this piece were expressed through his pipa, creating a sound that was as magnificent and dynamic as that of a symphony orchestra. This success made Fang Jinlong realize that Chinese folk music could take part on the international stage.

“国乐中的国，我当作是联合国的‘国’；乐，是属于世界音乐的‘乐’。”音乐会后，著名国乐艺术家、乐器收藏家、当代五弦琵琶代表人物方锦龙，面对大运河传媒记者的独家专访，这位在2019年哔哩哔哩（B站）跨年晚会中让国风音乐彻底出圈的国乐大师，娓娓道来他对国风音乐赓续创新、中外音乐文明互鉴，以及用国乐讲好中国故事走向世界的全新视角的思考。“The ‘country’ in national music, I consider it to be equivalent to the ‘country’ of the United Nations; ‘music’, on the other hand, belongs to world music.” After the concert, Fang Jinlong, a renowned artist specializing in national music, a collector of musical instruments, and a representative figure in contemporary five-string pipa music, gave an exclusive interview with media reporters from the Grand Canal. This master of national music who brought national-style music into the spotlight during the Bilibili New Year’s Eve party in 2019 shared his thoughts on the continuous innovation of national-style music, the exchange between Chinese and foreign musical cultures, and the idea of using national music to tell China’s stories to the world.

九千年古器奏新声，一把五弦琵琶吹响“世界音”Nine thousand years of ancient artifacts produce new sounds; a five-string pipa plays “worldly music”

一身长袍，满头白发，怀抱一把五弦琵琶，在新九州乐团热血侠义的《男儿当自强》交响开场后，方锦龙以这身标志性装扮，仙气十足地登场了。Dressed in a long robe, with white hair, and holding a five-string pipa, after the passionate symphony “A Man Should Be Self-reliant” performed by Xinjiuzhou Orchestra, Fang Jinlong appeared on stage in this distinctive attire, exuding a magical aura.

浓郁的国风味道扑面袭来。五弦琵琶演绎的《硕人》，把《诗经》里“手如柔荑，肤如凝脂”的千古绝色，勾勒成一幅流动的工笔画；一曲《玄鸟》，则将“天命玄鸟，降而生商”的远古图腾，化作弦上迸发的青铜时代磅礴气象……A strong sense of national style permeated the air. The piece “Shuoren” performed by the five-string pipa depicted the beauty described in the Book of Songs—“hands like soft grass, skin like frozen wax”—as a vivid painting; while “Xuanniang” transformed the ancient symbol “the fateful bird descends to bring forth the Shang dynasty” into the majestic atmosphere of the Bronze Age expressed through the strings.

“考考大家，知道中国最早的乐器有多少年历史吗？”在《弹古轮今》节目中，方锦龙吹奏起手中的贾湖骨龠，并介绍，这件乐器已有九千年历史，出土自中国河南，可见华夏音乐文明源远流长，领先世界，“这是我们文化自信的底气”。“Let me test everyone: Do you know how old the earliest musical instruments in China are?” In the program “Playing Ancient Instruments Today”, Fang Jinlong played the Jiahu bone zither. He explained that this instrument has a history of nine thousand years, and it was discovered in Henan, China. This shows that Chinese musical civilization has a long history and is more advanced than other cultures around the world. “This is the foundation of our cultural confidence.”

方锦龙最具代表性的成就，便是复原改良失传千年的唐代五弦琵琶，让这件古乐器重获新生，丰富了琵琶的音色层次。1300年前，唐代五弦琵琶作为唐朝赠予日本圣武天皇的礼物随遣唐使东渡日本。圣武天皇死后，琵琶被献给奈良东大寺大佛，藏于东大寺的正仓院内，是世上仅存的传世五弦琵琶。“我复原的不只是一根琴弦，更是中华民族的文化情怀。”采访中谈起此项成就，方锦龙解释说，中国人崇尚“五”，如五味俱全、墨分五色、五声音阶，他还表示，五弦琵琶曾是宫廷国礼，他要恢复的也是这份独属于东方的文化贵气。Fang Jinlong’s most significant achievement is the restoration and improvement of the five-stringed pipa from the Tang Dynasty, an instrument that had been lost for thousands of years. This effort brought this ancient musical instrument back to life, enhancing the variety of its sound tones. 1,300 years ago, the five-stringed pipa from the Tang Dynasty was given as a gift to Emperor Shōmu of Japan by the Tang Dynasty. After Emperor Shōmu’s death, the pipa was presented to the Great Buddha in Nara’s Hōryū Temple and kept in the Hōryū Temple’s Shōkōden Repository. It is the only surviving five-stringed pipa from that era. “What I have restored is not just one string, but also the cultural spirit of the Chinese nation,” Fang Jinlong said when discussing this achievement during the interview. He explained that the Chinese people value the number five – such as the five flavors of food, the five colors of ink, and the five musical scales. He also mentioned that the five-stringed pipa was once a royal gift from the imperial court; what he aims to restore is that unique Eastern cultural essence.

方锦龙用一把五弦琵琶模仿世界各地乐器音色的“名场面”再度上演，从阿拉伯到印度，再到西班牙，他带领观众完成了一场“环游世界”的音乐之旅，把整场音乐会推向高潮。同样精彩的要数《无论西东》节目，方锦龙与新九州爱乐乐团携手，演奏各种中西方乐器与曲目，五弦琵琶、尺八、锯琴、吉他、贝斯、打击乐...... 他一人切换驾驭古今中外多样乐器，一边演奏一边上演“方氏脱口秀”，以风趣诙谐的表达，带领观众读懂千年国乐背后的文化内核。Fang Jinlong once again presented a memorable performance in which he used a five-string pipa to imitate the sounds of musical instruments from various parts of the world. From Arabia to India, and then to Spain, he led the audience on a “world tour” through music, bringing the concert to its climax. Another impressive performance was the program “No Matter East or West”. Fang Jinlong collaborated with the New Kyushu Philharmonic Orchestra, playing a variety of Chinese and Western musical instruments and pieces – such as the five-string pipa, shakuhachi, shakuhachi, guitar, bass, and percussion instruments. He skillfully used these different instruments, both ancient and modern, from different cultures, and while playing, he also delivered humorous and witty commentary, helping the audience understand the cultural essence behind traditional Chinese music.

这是方锦龙演出中的品牌IP，搭建东西方器乐对话的舞台，打破不同音乐体系的壁垒，在同台演绎之中碰撞别样音乐火花。This is a brand identity associated with Fang Jinlong’s performances; it creates a platform for dialogue between Eastern and Western musical instruments, breaking down barriers between different musical systems and generating unique musical combinations during these performances.

能演奏近百种中外乐器， “行走的乐器库”是让大众在快乐中走进国乐Being able to play nearly a hundred kinds of musical instruments from both China and abroad makes Fang Jinlong a “walking instrument library” that allows people to experience traditional Chinese music in a joyful way

方锦龙和他的国风音乐真正走进大众视野、爆火出圈，源自2019年B站跨年晚会。在《韵·界》中，他一人驾驭多种中外乐器，与百人交响乐团同台碰撞，在传统古曲、动漫配乐、世界旋律之间自由切换，先后演奏出《十面埋伏》《沧海一声笑》《火影忍者主题曲》《教父主题曲》等风格迥异的音乐。这段演出视频创下了1.4亿次网络播放量，满屏弹幕都是“神仙打架”“请收下我的膝盖”。Fang Jinlong and his traditional Chinese music truly became popular among the public thanks to the Bilibili New Year’s Eve celebration in 2019. In the program “Yun·Jie”, he played various musical instruments from different cultures, performing alongside a symphony orchestra of hundreds of musicians. He freely switched between traditional classical music, anime background music, and international melodies, playing songs like “Ten Faces Embraced”, “A Laugh from the Sea”, “Naruto Theme”, and “The Godfather Theme”. This performance video received 140 million views on the internet, and comments on the video were filled with expressions like “incredible performances” and “please accept my knees”.

某种程度上看，这次爆红也是意料之中。1978年进入济南军区前卫民族乐团至今，方锦龙已深耕国乐四十余年，如何让传统国风走出小众圈层，被当代年轻群体乃至世界各地的人们所接纳，是他一直在实践的课题。To some extent, this sudden popularity was expected. Since entering the Jinan Military Region’s Front Guard National Orchestra in 1978, Fang Jinlong has been dedicated to traditional Chinese music for over forty years. The challenge he has been working on is how to make traditional Chinese music acceptable to contemporary young people and people around the world.

不同于传统音乐会单纯演奏的模式，他将脱口秀式幽默主持融入现场，把乐器典故穿插在演出之中。在吹奏鼻箫时，他向观众介绍，这是黎族青年男女谈恋爱时用鼻子吹奏的一种乐器，开玩笑说：“我发现少数民族同胞就是比我们汉族有情调，乐器用鼻子吹，嘴就可以闲下来做别的事。”听到观众会心一笑，方锦龙又故作不解：“你们笑什么？我是指，嘴可以喝椰汁。”逗得全场狂笑不止。Unlike traditional concert performances that focus solely on playing instruments, Fang Jinlong incorporates comedic humor into his performances, and weaves stories related to musical instruments into his shows. When playing the nose flute, he explains to the audience that it is a instrument used by young men and women of the Li ethnic group to express emotions through breathing. He jokes, “I find that ethnic minorities have more charm than us Han people. We use our mouths to speak, while they use their noses to play instruments.” The audience laughs, and Fang Jinlong pretends to be confused: “Why are you laughing? I mean, we can drink coconut juice with our mouths.” This joke causes everyone to laugh.

基于扎实的五弦琵琶功底，方锦龙博采众长、一专多能，能演奏近百种中外乐器，同时收藏了两千余件乐器，被网友称为“行走的乐器库”。弹奏之外，他喜欢研究乐器背后的文化。采访中他介绍，“品相”源自琵琶的品与相，“巧舌如簧”来自簧类乐器，“参差不齐”出自排箫。他提倡博采众长、触类旁通，不赞同封闭狭隘的单一“专精”，主张拓宽艺术视野，在传承的基础上大胆吸收多元文化养分。With his solid skills in the five-stringed pipa, Fang Jinlong has learned from various instruments and can play nearly a hundred different musical instruments from both China and abroad. He also owns more than two thousand musical instruments, and netizens call him “the walking instrument library”. Besides playing music, he enjoys studying the culture behind the instruments. In an interview, he says that “pinyin” comes from the terms used for the pipa, “clever tongue” comes from reed instruments, and “uneven shape” comes from flutes. He advocates learning from various sources and not sticking to a narrow focus on one type of instrument. He believes it’s important to broaden one’s artistic horizons and incorporate diverse cultural elements while preserving traditions.

比如这次音乐会，他携手新九州爱乐乐团，联袂演绎《梁祝》《渔舟唱晚》《沧海一声笑》等经典曲目。民乐的意蕴与交响乐的恢弘交织，传统底蕴碰撞新潮表达，激荡出不一样的视听感受。“降低国乐欣赏门槛，让大众先感受快乐，再走进国乐。”方锦龙表示，他希望通过充满趣味的方式，让观众不只听旋律，爱国乐，更读懂乐器承载的中华文化内涵。For example, at this concert, he collaborated with the New Jiuzhou Philharmonic Orchestra to perform classic pieces like “Liang Zhu”, “Fishing Boat at Dusk”, and “A Laugh from the Sea”. The essence of traditional Chinese music meets the grandeur of symphony music, and the tradition meets modern expression, creating a unique auditory experience. “We aim to lower the barrier for people to appreciate traditional Chinese music, so that they can first feel joy before getting involved with it,” says Fang Jinlong. He hopes that in a fun way, the audience can not only hear the melodies but also understand the cultural significance of the instruments.

创新不等于盲目复刻西方模式。方锦龙清醒指出，东方乐器重个性，西方交响乐重共性，民族音乐不必一味追求交响化，同样需要“大音希声，大象无形”，就像中国各地方言，独特韵味正是民族音乐的魅力所在。“传承不守旧，创新不离根”，这是方锦龙践行的国乐发展之路，在他看来，传统国乐既要守住自身根脉，也要打开眼界吸收创新，才能跨越年龄圈层，跨越山海国界，让中国音乐故事被更多人听见。Innovation doesn’t mean blindly copying Western models. Fang Jinlong clearly states that Eastern instruments emphasize individuality, while Western symphonies focus on commonalities. Traditional Chinese music doesn’t have to become like symphonies; it still needs “great sounds without form, and great shapes without form”. Just like the dialects of different regions in China, their unique flavors are what make traditional Chinese music attractive. “Preserving traditions without being rigid, and innovating without losing roots” is the approach Fang Jinlong takes in developing traditional Chinese music. In his view, traditional Chinese music should maintain its roots while also opening up to new ideas and innovations, so that it can transcend age and geographical barriers, and allow more people to hear Chinese musical stories.

中国音符已成国际语汇，文化自信展开平视世界的视角Chinese musical notes have become part of the international language. Cultural confidence enables a perspective that looks at the world on an equal footing

“早在几十年前，中国的民族音乐在国外就非常受欢迎。如果说，几十年前，我们的民族音乐几乎处于方言时代；渐渐地，民族音乐进展到普通话时代；而近10年来，它已经进入国际语汇。比如我们的侗族大歌，到了法国一样很受欢迎，欧洲观众一听，惊讶地说中国很多年前就有和声了。国乐渐渐在世界舞台大放异彩，越来越多的外国观众喜欢上我们的民族音乐。”“Decades ago, Chinese ethnic music was very popular abroad. Back then, our ethnic music was largely in a dialectic stage; gradually, it advanced to the stage of Mandarin. In the past 10 years, it has even become part of the international musical repertoire. For example, the Dong ethnic songs are very popular in France as well. European listeners are amazed to learn that China already had harmonies many centuries ago. Chinese traditional music is gradually gaining prominence on the world stage, and more and more foreign audiences are becoming fond of our ethnic music.”

演出中奏响的贾湖骨龠，出土于河南舞阳贾湖遗址，距今9000‑7500年，由丹顶鹤翅骨打磨而成，七孔版本可完整演奏七声音阶。方锦龙表示，这不仅将我国的音乐历史上溯到九千年，也颠覆了西方人“中国古代只有五声音阶”的刻板印象。方锦龙把这件复原古乐器带上国内以及海外各大舞台。他提到，阿拉伯纳伊笛同样为斜吹乐器，与贾湖骨龠遥相呼应，是不同古老文明之间不谋而合的音乐智慧，也是文化自信的鲜活物证。The Jiahu bone flute played during the performance originated from the Jiahu site in Wuyang, Henan, with a history of 9,000–7,500 years. It was crafted from the bones of red-crowned cranes, and its seven-holes version allows for the performance of the seven-tone scale. Fang Jinlong said that this not only brings China’s musical history back to nine thousand years ago, but also challenges the Western stereotype that “ancient China had only five-tone scales”. Fang Jinlong has performed this ancient instrument both domestically and overseas. He mentioned that the Arab na’i flute is also a transverse-blown instrument, which complements the Jiahu bone flute. This shows the shared musical wisdom among different ancient civilizations, as well as evidence of cultural confidence.

“西方的钢琴是‘律有数’，我们的民乐叫‘韵无穷’。”这是方锦龙对东西方音乐特质的概括。他始终倡导平视看待不同文明，既不俯视，也不仰视外来文化。他提出，国乐是“联合国”的国，世界音乐的乐。回望历史，笙管笛箫多为本土乐器；琵琶、二胡、唢呐等两字名称乐器，经由丝绸之路传入，经过世代消化融合，最终化为中国民族乐器。“中华民族的音乐，自古就拥有兼容并蓄的底色，东西方音乐从来不是对立，而是你中有我、我中有你的交融共生。”方锦龙说。“Western pianos have a fixed rhythm; our traditional Chinese music, on the other hand, has an endless melody.” This is Fang Jinlong’s description of the characteristics of Eastern and Western music. He always advocates for treating different cultures on an equal footing, without looking down on or admiring foreign cultures in a superior manner. He believes that traditional Chinese music is like a “member” of the United Nations, a part of world music. Looking back through history, instruments such as shang, flutes, and bamboo pipes were mostly local instruments. Instruments like the pipa, erhu, and suona were introduced through the Silk Road. Over time, they became part of Chinese national instruments. “The music of the Chinese nation has always had a spirit of inclusiveness. Eastern and Western music are not opposites; they coexist and blend together.” says Fang Jinlong.

在海外演出，方锦龙用琵琶来弹《爱的罗曼史》《阿斯图里亚斯》，外国人听了总能引起共鸣。“不仅中国人喜爱国乐，如今喜欢国乐的外国人也越来越多。”此前他赴法国、西班牙等国演出，现场观众中不乏外国友人，外国的“知音”越来越多。他受邀参加“21世纪日本地球系列音乐会”之敦煌复原乐器演奏会，日本观众从30多个城市赶来观看这场音乐会，很多人说“这就是我梦想的音乐”。During performances abroad, Fang Jinlong uses the pipa to play pieces like “A Romance of Love” and “Asturias”. Foreign audiences often find these performances very inspiring. “Not only do Chinese people love traditional Chinese music, but more and more foreigners also enjoy it.” In previous performances in France, Spain, and other countries, there were many foreign spectators. There are more and more “fellows” among foreigners who appreciate this music. He was invited to participate in the Dunhuang Recreated Instrument Performance during the “21st Century Japan Earth Series Concert”. Audiences from over 30 cities came to watch this concert, and many said, “This is the music I dream of.”

“你会别人的乐器，你才能把吉他的感觉转化成琵琶的韵味，如果你没有这些乐器的基础，你不可能做到。”“Only by being able to play with foreign instruments can you transform the feel of the guitar into the flavor of the pipa. Without a foundation in these instruments, it’s impossible to do so.”

让方锦龙感到惊喜的是，近几年，前来学习中国古典乐器的外国学生越来越多了。“随着国门的打开，很多外国人对汉学很感兴趣，来到中国学习汉语、学习中国文化，但很少有人教民族乐器。我认为让这些洋学生在学汉学的同时，再学一门中国乐器，会让中国文化得到更好的传播，这叫有声有色。比如，我的一个美国学生回国后用琵琶弹美国乡村音乐，其他外国人听了，觉得新鲜好玩，就开始关注中国民族乐器，这就是中华优秀传统文化的影响力。要想让琵琶走向世界，首先就得让外国人接触琵琶，这样他们才会产生兴趣。”What surprised Fang Jinlong was that in recent years, more and more foreign students have come to learn Chinese classical instruments. “With the opening of China’s doors, many foreigners are interested in learning Chinese culture. They come to China to study Chinese language and culture, but few of them learn traditional Chinese instruments. I think it would be better if these foreigners could learn both Chinese language and one Chinese instrument at the same time. This would help spread Chinese culture more effectively. For example, one of my American students played American country music with the pipa after returning to his country. Other foreigners found it interesting and started to pay attention to Chinese national instruments. This is the influence of excellent traditional Chinese culture. To make the pipa popular worldwide, it’s necessary for foreigners to get in touch with it first. Only then will they become interested.”

谈及国乐出海，方锦龙有着独到见解：“真正的文化自信，是让世界走向我们”。方锦龙对大运河传媒记者表示。When discussing the spread of traditional Chinese music abroad, Fang Jinlong has his own insights: “True cultural confidence means enabling the world to move towards us,” said Fang Jinlong to reporters from the Grand Canal Media.

他说，以扬州为例，唐朝时的扬州是盛极一时的国际大都市，万国商贾云集，是世界向扬州走来，向中国走来。在今天的世界，要看兵马俑，都得去西安，而要听中国音乐，不能不来“诗乐之都扬州” 。在方锦龙看来，扬州是名副其实的中国诗乐之城，千年文脉孕育出仅唐诗中就有两万余首吟咏扬州，更不用说张若虚的“孤篇盖全唐”的《春江花月夜》。He said that, taking Yangzhou as an example, during the Tang Dynasty, Yangzhou was a renowned international metropolis. Merchants from all over the world gathered there, and the world came to Yangzhou and China in general. In Fang Jinlong’s view, Yangzhou is indeed a true city of poetry and music in China. Over thousands of years of cultural development, more than 20,000 poems have been written about Yangzhou, not to mention Zhang Ruoxu’s masterpiece “Spring River Flower Moon Night”, which is considered a masterpiece that encompasses all of the poems of the Tang Dynasty.

他将自己视作一座“流动的乐器博物馆”，用贾湖骨龠、五弦琵琶告诉世界，“只有读懂中国，才能传播中国；只有了解世界，才能融入世界。真诚的音乐，全世界都能听懂。（晖军董明桂艳）He regards himself as a “mobile museum of musical instruments”. With the Jiahu zither and the five-stringed pipa, he shows the world that “only by understanding China can one spread Chinese culture; only by understanding the world can one integrate into it. True music can be understood by everyone in the world.” (Hui Jun, Dong Ming, Gui Yan)